seven

**Uberchris** · September 4th, 2009, 09:31 PM

i know it is still new, but im seriously considering buying a seven instead of a troll. i keep hearing about the flare power and how the seven kicks major ass in deep brakes and sinks, and from my little experience, i have flown a mojo 280 and a troll 265 mdv. i truly liked the brakes/deep brakes on the mojo. anyone have a significant amount of jumps on a seven yet and care to comment? i realize it does not have vents.

**fenix66** · September 5th, 2009, 12:40 PM

I have a BJ and SEVEN, and honestly I'm selling my BJ, to get another SEVEN ! More flare power and deep brake approaches....GET OUTTA HERE !!! It opens as quick or quicker than my vented and is flyable right Now !! In my humble opinion SEVEN is best canopy out there !!!

**skydive1224** · September 7th, 2009, 11:13 AM

I can fly my Seven farther than my Blackjack and sink it deeper than my Blackjack. I havn't done enough static lines to compare pressurization at slow speeds, but the seven opens up quick and starts flying right away with anything longer than a 1.5 second delay. I still love flying both my blackjacks, but the Seven rocks. I am planning on buying a Feather version to skydive with.

Ody

**lifewithoutanet** · September 7th, 2009, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by Uberchris

i know it is still new, but im seriously considering buying a seven instead of a troll. i keep hearing about the flare power and how the seven kicks major ass in deep brakes and sinks, and from my little experience, i have flown a mojo 280 and a troll 265 mdv. i truly liked the brakes/deep brakes on the mojo. anyone have a significant amount of jumps on a seven yet and care to comment? i realize it does not have vents.

I have 6 or 7 jumps on a demo Seven (260), slider-up and -down, from two different objects. Each involved somewhat-lengthy flights to the LZ.

First impression in flight is that I've never felt so connected to a BASE canopy. I attribute this to the speed and energy of the wing in full flight and even partial brakes. Speed/energy translates to stability...that's the 'connection' I'm talking about. It felt more like a speed-wing. The energy you had going into a turn kept you centered and connected to the wing, as opposed to swinging around under it...and I played some serious pinball on one short final. Still, didn't feel like I was some hapless pendulum under it.

Going from a 260 BlackJack CUS to the non-CUS Seven fucked with me a little, though. That's not to say I was disappointed in the Seven. I just had different expectations on the glide. The Seven is to be an evolution, an improvement. It matched right up with my CUS BlackJack in some areas and exceeded in others.

The Seven has more versatility and a smaller pack volume, if not quite as low as the Trango or Feather.

If I were going to buy another canopy, right now my personal choice would be a 260 Seven with CUS and it most likely wouldn't be vented. After jumping it and talking with Marty, I'm not sure think that canopy really needs them. <enter shitstorm>

-C.

**aDodgyOne** · September 16th, 2009, 11:12 AM

I have 6 or 7 jumps on a demo Seven (260), slider-up and -down, from two different objects. Each involved somewhat-lengthy flights to the LZ..........…
............... That's not to say I was disappointed in the Seven. I just had different expectations on the glide. The Seven is to be an evolution, an improvement. It matched right up with my CUS BlackJack in some areas and exceeded in others.

so where did it fall behind? compared to the BJ?

also in your opionion. do you feel the "new" fabric used on the Seven gives the canopu more glide than a regular F111 canopy.

**aDodgyOne** · September 16th, 2009, 07:09 PM

so whats up with the whole no vent thing anyway?

anybody ever heard of a 180 on a low E? so having vents in that situation is good? Right?

hows the 7 going to fare in that exact situation?

just wondering?

**Uberchris** · September 16th, 2009, 07:33 PM

very true my real concern with vents is strictly engaging in a cliffstrike, not necessarily in a faster SD opening. i like what i hear though regarding this canopy and i must call marty. maybe i could rent a rig from him and hit perrine for a weekend?

**lifewithoutanet** · September 17th, 2009, 06:04 AM

Originally Posted by aDodgyOne

I have 6 or 7 jumps on a demo Seven (260), slider-up and -down, from two different objects. Each involved somewhat-lengthy flights to the LZ..........…
............... That's not to say I was disappointed in the Seven. I just had different expectations on the glide. The Seven is to be an evolution, an improvement. It matched right up with my CUS BlackJack in some areas and exceeded in others.

so where did it fall behind? compared to the BJ?

also in your opionion. do you feel the "new" fabric used on the Seven gives the canopu more glide than a regular F111 canopy.

It didn't fall behind. It matched up in some areas and exceeded it in others. As for the fabric, I would assume so, but can't say for certain. I deliberately did not lay it out next to any other canopies (F111 or ZP) to pick through it and analyze every point. I didn't want to start making assumptions that would lead me to form any conclusions before I jumped it.
-C.

**lifewithoutanet** · September 17th, 2009, 06:08 AM

Originally Posted by aDodgyOne

so whats up with the whole no vent thing anyway?

anybody ever heard of a 180 on a low E? so having vents in that situation is good? Right?

hows the 7 going to fare in that exact situation?

just wondering?

Call Martin and ask him. He'd be the better one to fully explain it, but the design of this canopy provides for the inflation of cells even when up against a wall, even without vents. And it's already survived a cliffstrike, staying pressurized down the wall for a good distance.
I'm not going to get involved in a vents/no-vents argument. Each of my other canopies are vented. I'm not saying canopies don't need vents, I'm saying I'm not certain this one does.
-C.

**hamsandwich** · September 18th, 2009, 12:08 PM

Unvented canopies stay inflated even up against a cliff. They're all trimmed down, air gets in. If you're overdoing you're input and stall the wing, they ALL will collapse. Any air going in the vents will come right out the nose if you've overdone your toggle or riser input to backup.

I remember a friend who had an unfortunate 180 on a low cliff with an Ace (an unvented canopy). The wing stayed presurized as he rode the ball down on to a ledge.

Some canopy designs need vents to pressurize correctly because of their trim a design. Others give fastER pressurization.

No valves seals perfectly on a canopy so you do still have a little loss out the vents on flare, more drag, more pack volume.

95% of my jumps have been with unvented canopies. Maybe I've been lucky??

I'm not against vents, but my thoughts and experiences lead me to disagree when people absolutely need to have vents almost implying that unvented canopies don't perform.

I get a composite upper surface for the money instead of vents.

-a

**Uberchris** · September 21st, 2009, 10:11 PM

this is interesting. i have never dealt with a cliffstrike so far, but then again ive only got 25 jumps. i know every single situation would be different, and instinct would be all you have in that situation, but it seems that it would be better to try and ride it out, smacking the wall on your way down, than to crank too hard on your risers and either completely collapse your wing, or lose rear riser altitude to the point where u burn straight in.

i have stalled my canopy out in a skydive environment several times able to back up for a few seconds, and yes the wing obviously gets distorted, but not fully collapsed. if you are at the stall point and are simultaneously smacking a solid object, i assume that wing has a much higher risk of collapsing causing you to fall to your demise?

i wish i could understand canopies more, im just not there yet with sub 200 skydives. apologies if i sound like an idiot but...............