A UK name for a system starting from static-line and progressing through to free-fall after successive dummy-pulls and increasing delays.
A UK name for a system starting from static-line and progressing through to free-fall after successive dummy-pulls and increasing delays.
Did this Guy Jump Stowed or Unstowed?
Greetings Martin, (and others).
My initial impression was to answer this thread just to say that the 200 or 500 or 100 skydive minimum figure is BOGUS.
A jaded old dawg such as myself would say,” the more skydives they, ( the student), have, the more they are exposed to “modern skydivers” , thus the more they are exposed to “bad habits / improper equipment” which have very little relevance to BASE jumping skills.
IMO a prospective BASEr can learn more in ( fill in the blank” CReW jumps that include skills directly relevant to BASE than in [log] times more freefly / rw jumps.
CReW jumpers generally have;
1. greater gear / rigging knowledge than a fun jumper.
2. we jump low aspect ratio 7 – cells, although with the change to ZP the canopies are quite small.
3. we tend to pack carefully so as to prevent off heading openings from killing us on deployment when we are in close proximity with our buds.
4. we take short delays, usually with our hands on our puds <G>!
enough of that.
Who cares?
But to answer your questions from my perspective, see below
Mick (and everyone else),
I genuinely don't know the answer to these questions and mean well by asking them, take them as you see them.
How many skydives did you have before your first BASE jump?
~ 180
What was your first BASE jump off?
The big greenie in your backyard in march of 82.
How many canopy control jumps did you have?
20 student jumps under rounds, 100 RW jumps under rounds, dactyls and squares, 60 CReW jumps under squares.
Were you slightly more reckless when you started BASE jumping than you are today?
No, I was dramatically more reckless, due mostly to ignorance and poor gear selection. These reasons can still transmit directly to anyone starting today if they don’t take the time to fill their brain with knowledge. It was a bit more challenging in ’82, no internet don’t ya know.
I only ask because I see so many righteous skydivers and BASE jumpers who took plenty of risks early in their sport who now think the entire mentality of first timers should change because of their experience. The fact is that this sport attracts a lot of people who find the DZ too restrictive and consequently there is a slight chance of getting sole operators in this sport.
I don’t think that anyone has to change their “mentality” because of my, or anyone else’s prior experiences.
BUT
I think that they are fools if they do not learn from other peoples experiences
I do wish that all jumpers played safe and learnt from all the previous jumps that have been done. In reality though there are always going to be those who try to reinvent the wheel, ignore advice and generally do what the pioneers did in the first instance. This doesn't make them pioneers.
Correct. IMO it indicates that they are either ignorant or foolish. There are few valid reasons to be ignorant in today’s information rich environment.
This guy is an idiot and one of many that will enter the sport the wrong way.
Sad, but true.
More later if you are interested.
Stay Safe
Craig F.
Hey D
What this means is that he wasn't just told (by the Portland crew, anyway) "get 200 skydives and call me in the morning." While I do not disagree that this minimum number has a logical foundation n that it helps to inculcate minimal canopy control and gear awareness, I also want to make clear that the reason for this incident was NOT that he was turned away by his "local" jumping community - in this case, "local" meaning anything ?within a reasonable drive.
This guy was told by more than one person to go to Idaho. He didn't want to take the time off work.
He'll certain get some time off now.:-(
>How many skydives did you have before your first
>BASE jump?
Around 250 (give or take 10). I'd have to dig my skydiving logbook out of the cobwebs to know for sure.
>What was your first BASE jump off?
A 700' span.
>How many canopy control jumps did you have?
Around 30. Again, I'd have to dig out the logbook to know for sure. I started training the canopy skills right at 200 jumps, when I started looking for a first jump instructor. Before that I had around 100 RW jumps and 100 Freefly jumps.
>Were you slightly more reckless when you started
>BASE jumping than you are today?
Definitely not. I have grown more reckless (in a physical safety sense) throughout my BASE career. I do not believe this is entirely related to my progression as a BASE jumper.
One other point: I actively sought out (some would say pestered and harrasssed) the 200+ BASE jumper who I knew and thought would give me the best instruction. My first jump (and my next 25 or so, actually) was done with him (Thanks Pete!).
--Tom Aiello
tbaiello@mac.com
Hi all,
I remember my first jump, I had 450 skydives.
It was off of a 600 foot freestanding godsend that has since been torn down. I did this jump under Martins tutalage,(which I am sure he regreted on more than one subsequent occasion).
I am probally the most obsessive compulsive person I know, You could not have stopped me from base jumping if you tried, the difference was I did it by showing up on martins doorway every morning until he figured the only way to get rid of me was to teach me how to jump and live.
There is no excuse for 138 and first jump. I don't really see any reason for 138 and any jump, but I guess I am just getting old. Darwin takes care of the stupid jumpers for us. I took chances, more when I was new then I do now, but even on my first jump I knew what I was doing, I had no experience but I knew what I was doing. This guy deserved to go in.
Anyone remember the guy who jumped the field packed rig at mineral canyon two years ago? He deserved to go in too. I like to teach that we buy the jump when we leave the edge, I had better be able to afford the payments.
Brian
>How many skydives did you have before your first
>BASE jump?
About 1200.
>What was your first BASE jump off?
#7 Kjerag
>How many canopy control jumps did you have?
I'd done about 150 skydives on large 7 cells canopies, most fairly early in my jumping career.
If I had it to do over again, I'd definitely recommend being more current on them than I was when I started BASE jumping, as well as jumping an even larger canopy. I have a 220, and weigh about 160 lbs. It's great for Twin Falls, but kind of sucked when landing in a tight area at 5000+ feet above sea level. There are several sites that I won't jump until I get a larger canopy.
>Were you slightly more reckless when you started
>BASE jumping than you are today?
In the sense that I didn't have as much knowledge with which to judge the risks on a given jump, yes.
-Josh
I think that the only way to control this issue is to control the gear sales at a personal level. I had an interest in BASE in the early ninties, but got into Paragliding because it was available and the instruction was easy to find. If I would have just been able to purchase stuff I would have probably thought that my one AFF would suffice and start thinking about base.
I then found a BASE jumper by mistake and thought about it and did some ground crew and watched and learned what the results of a mistake could be and is.
I was thankful that I found someone to teach me and that I did my skydives and put almost 400 hours under my paraglider. I have made a few mistakes that canopy skills are the reason I have come out of them walking, but most importantly I am glad that people to the time to teach me about safety and the do's and don'ts.
People will do what they are going to do regardless of what others say. I would just hope that the gear is hard to find and not just put up for sale to the highest bidder on ebay.
Tom
The message you posted involves quite a few man-hours and influence, probably not easy do-able by many. Never the less....
You said Mick and others has done a lot of work already on such a curriculum, and possibly you have seen similar work done by the Ausies. If you post such a 'curriculum', on this site, and try to get current BASE jumpers to acknowledge this, (by time, and not by force) it would be easier for them to keep an eye on newbies (not those who do the lone thing though).
If for example, I want to start to BASE, some existing jumper can help me step through this 'cirriculum', help me achieve as many goals as possible, and in return, they would be less reluctant to take on newbies, or take them out for their first jump. Once this mindset gets to grow, it will easily be accepted by instructors, (such as tandem instructors, and others), and advance has been made. Look at this, as a enhancement to the 200 jumps rule. Every body knows this. Extend it.
The first person to try out your cirriculum, would definitely be me. So, I am pretty sure feedback, errors and enhancements, will be plenty from existing jumpers, and those who want's to get in.
Rigalo
Hi Rigalo,
Send me an email, and I'll forward a copy of my personal draft curriculum to you sometime next week (I already owe one other person a copy, but I won't be back at the computer that it's saved on until next week).
--Tom Aiello
tbaiello@mac.com
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