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Thread: NPS POLICIES CAUSE ANOTHER BASE DEATH

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  1. #1
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    NPS POLICIES CAUSE ANOTHER BASE DEATH

    Once again, a skydiver has died as a direct consequence of the National Park Service's perverted policies. Neither Frank nor Jan would be dead today had it not been for this policy promulgated by an NPS sexual pervert named M. Scott Conelly and continued by individuals that can only be described as Connelly's Cops.

    And we are Connelly's Kids: Connelly's Cops stick it to us the same way M.Scott sticks it to the young boys of whom he is so fond (remember, he's out of jail already and no doubt back to his delightful old habits).

    Andy West can talk all he wants about personal responsibility, and he's not wrong, but he misses the larger point: Government accountability.

    Frank would not have jumped into the raging Merced River and Jan would not have jumped El Capitan with borrowed gear had it not been for continuing persecution of BASE jumpers by the NPS. Period.

    And now they are both dead because of it. It's happened again, and let no one lose hope over the outcome. Once again, a skydiver has died as a direct consequence of the National Park Service's perverted policies. Neither Frank nor Jan would be dead today had it not been for this policy promulgated by an NPS sexual pervert named M. Scott Conelly and continued by individuals that can only be described as Connelly's Cops.

    And we are Connelly's Kids: The NPS sticks it us the same way M.Scott sticks it to the young boys of whom he is so fond (remember, he's out of jail already and no doubt back to his delightful old habits).

    Andy West can talk all he wants about personal responsibility, and he's not wrong, but he misses the larger pointl: Government ACCOUNTABILITY.

    Frank would not have jumped into the raging Merced River and Jan would not have been jumping El Capitan with borrowed gear had it not been for continuing persecution of BASE jumpers by the NPS. Period.

    And now they are both dead because of it. But people, don't lose hope, and don't whine about Jan's death shutting down opportunities forever to BASE jump in NPS-occupied zones. This is simply a larger and louder wakeup call that this persecution and discrimination must stop.

    The best way we can honor Jan's memory is to hold her alongside Frank as an example of how NPS's perverted policy leads to tragedy -- over and over and over again. That's the bottom line: How many more people have to die before the perversion stops?

    Finally, let me say to all the flame weenies and back-seat whiners:

    1) I counted Jan Davis among my very close friends and her death affects me deeply on a personal level, and I know her spirit is smiling at these words and saying, "Yeah, what he said."

    2) Save your shitty little second-guessing remarks for your fellow defeatists. Now is the time to stand in solidarity together against the NPS instead of -- once again -- fighting amongst ourselves and pointing fingers of blame.





  2. #2
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    Stand together but put the responsibility where it belongs

    I've heard a lot of this "blame the NPS" theme on the board, and it's time for it to stop.

    First of all, let me say that I think the NPS policies are completely ridiculous and discriminatory. And although I've never met Mr. Connelly, he seems to have been on a mission to squash our sport and obviously has some serious personal problems to sort out. Lastly, I owe a debt of gratitude to those who participated in the protest jump, trying to gain myself and every other base jumper access to our parks.

    But regardless of how wrong the NPS policies are, they are NOT to blame for Frank's death. Nor are they to blame for Jan's death. When we hurt...when we're mourning the loss of people who died too soon, we want someone to focus our anger on, because it's easier to be angry than anguished. And that's what we're doing. But the reality is, no one forced Frank to jump into the river. Before he jumped, he knew what would happen if he got caught, and he jumped anyway. At the moment of decision (or maybe he had even made the decision before the jump), he chose not to face the consequences of his actions, and tried to escape through the river. By his own choice, he ran into the river and it killed him. If he had submitted to the cops, he'd be out a set of gear and have paid some fines, but he'd still be alive. How many of his friends and family would gladly pay 10 times that amount now to have him back with them? Doesn't that put it in perspective? And with Jan, it wasn't NPS policy that killed her, either. We, the base jumping community, decided to hold the protest jump. We didn't have to. She didn't have to jump in it. She chose to. She knew what would happen after the jump before she decided to be a part of it. She chose the gear she would use, and she jumped off the cliff. Habit took over in her mind, I guess, and it killed her. But it was her decision to step off the edge with that gear on her back, and no one forced her to participate in the protest that no one forced us to have. The best way to honor the memories of these two fallen friends is not to make them into examples of what NPS is doing to us, but to learn from their mistakes while we continue to pursue a cause they believed in--legal BASE in national parks.

    If I went out, bought a gun, loaded it, and shot myself in the head, would I then sue the gun manufacturer for my injuries? Of course not! Because when you boil it down to the bottom line, it was my choice and my action that produced my injuries. It is the same with jumping off cliffs and bridges and everything else--it is inherently dangerous, and no one can claim with a straight face that they didn't know that before they took the leap. And if you do something against the law, as dumb as the law may be, you cannot tell me that you did't expect to be punished if you got caught.

    I know sometimes you just need to vent and place the blame on something/someone concrete, especially when the world around you seems full of unexplainable tragedies, but please know that it is dangerous to promote this "pass the buck" way of thinking. Eventually it will come back to bite us because it makes us look like a bunch of angry children who are too foolish or cowardly to accept personal responsibility for our actions and for the danger inherent to our sport. The government is not my babysitter (nor do I want it to be), and I do not hold it accountable for my actions.

    Bottom line: We need to stand together in opposing ludicrous NPS policies, but we need to stand in the truth by putting the ultimate responsibility where it belongs. Even if it's hard to do in the wake of such painful losses.

    My prayers are with Tom and all of you struggling with Jan's home-going (because we all know that angels on loan to us go back home to God)...

  3. #3
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    WELL PUT

    B * R * A * V * O !!!!!!!!!!!!

  4. #4
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    Responsibility _is_ where it belongs -- on the perverted policies of Connelly's Cops

    Mari darling:

    It is certainly noble of you to insist that we all take personal responsibility for our actions. And it is refreshing for both you and Andy to urge this in a society which seems suicidally set on blaming everyone and everything but the individuals themselves for the things that happen to them in life.

    But in so doing, you miss the larger point: Government exists to reduce harm and when its actions increase harm, _it_ must be held responsible and accountable for _its_ actions.

    Fair is fair, after all.

    And unfortunately, your analogy about the gun is just wrong: Suing someone because they _allowed_ you to make a personal choice that resulted in your death or injury is unconscionable cowardice; fighting against a government because it _prohibits_ you from doing something -- and that prohibition results in injury or death, well, that’s a little different animal, wouldn’t you say?

    A better analogy is back alley abortions. If government prohibits abortion, abortions continue, but in much more dangerous conditions, and so, if a woman because she chose to get a back alley abortion, was she responsible for her death?

    Yes, according to your view, and you’re not wrong, but in the _larger_ view, the government which prevented her from getting an abortion in safe circumstances is equally culpable.

    And you must consider consistency here too: Dennis McGlynn is now doing a federal prison sentence because the government said _he_ is responsible for Paul Thompson’s death – despite the fact that Paul drove his own car, had his own boat and gear, and simply hung out with Dennis’ group. Yet, Dennis got prison time because the judge considered him to be responsible for Thompson’s death.

    Yet this connection is considerably more tenuous than the much more direct line responsibilities for Frank’s death that the NPS and the scumbag who narced him have. First, Connelly’s Cops cultivate and reward the coward who narced him. Then they set up a stakeout. Then they blow the arrest and chase him into the river. Even street cops pull off of felony pursuits when they think the pursuit might result in tragedy. Not so Connelly’s Cops: They go to the limit to molest us, just like their mentor did to young boys.

    Ditto for Jan: The NPS’s perverted policy that _steals_ the private property of American citizens was directly responsible for her decision to use borrowed gear – and for an alleged "crime" equal to feeding the squirrels. Imagine, Mari, how you would feel – how the country would feel – if Connelly’s Cops seized your car (and KEPT it) because you or a friend tossed a piece of popcorn out the window to a squirrel.

    That’s what we’re talking about here, and _that_ is an issue involving _government_ responsibility.

    Connelly’s Cops are _utterly irresponsible_ and not answerable for their actions. No Connelly Cop will ever do time for Frank’s death or Jan’s. And why would they? Even the Great Molester himself, Marshall Scott Connelly, walked out of a Fresno court on his four felony counts of unlawful sex with minors after just 16 months in a mental ward – and that after the kidnapping charges were dropped (which would have brought 20 years). As Fred Morelli said, for a non-cop, the plea bargaining for doing little boys on video starts at 25 _years_, and the usual sentence is 16 _years_, not 16 months.

    So Mari, let’s hear a little from you on government’s responsibility and accountability before you attack us for blaming NPS for this situation.

    I know you mean well, but face the facts: When I jumped from the Royal Gorge Bridge with Carl Boenish in 1979, the cops grabbed us, but then let us go because the only thing they could charge us with was "throwing objects from the bridge." Not being Connelly’s Cops, the local gendarmes decided it would be silly to use that law – which actually had more foundation to it than the utterly inapplicable and illegitimate usage of the "air delivery without a permit" reg, which was written before BASE jumping existed and was designed exclusively to deal with the aerial resupply of squatters and miners in NPS-occupied zones.

    Government can’t have it both ways: It can’t hold us to narrow definitions and reserve broad ones for itself. It cannot claim personal responsibility for our actions, then deny any responsibility for its own.

    And I say again: think about what Frank’s final choice says about Connelly’s Cops and their perverted policy: He chose to risk death rather than let those perverts put their hands on him. Ditto for Jan: She chose a greater risk of death rather than let Connelly’s Cops put their perverted hands on her cherished parachute equipment.

    There are countless examples throughout history of people who chose death before submission to barbarians, scumbags and criminals. And yes, they were responsible for their own actions and deaths. But does that responsibility make their attackers any less perverted and evil?

    Mari, I don’t think unkindly of you, and in general I absolutely agree with your personal responsibility mantra. But the issue here is _government responsibility and accountability_ and when you shift the focus therefrom, you so the same disservice to this crusade as do the backbiters and second guessers.

    So please keep your eyes on the prize: Ending the reign of Connelly’s Cops and bringing peace once again to the valley that John Muir called God’s grandest cathedral.


  5. #5
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    BASE44, you make no sense

    In your message BASE44 wrote : Suing someone because they _allowed_ you to make a personal choice that resulted in your death or injury is unconscionable cowardice; fighting against a government because it _prohibits_ you from doing something -- and that prohibition results in injury or death, well, thats a little different animal, wouldnt you say?

    When we jump, we make a personal choice. (At least I do, no one has ever forced me to make a jump). The governmennt prohibits our hobby, and your personal feelings about how or why it is prohibited are irrelevant. One can choose to honor the prohibition and stay home, or choose to ignore it and face the charges if caught. Those are the "personal choices" available. After the decision is taken to ignore the prohibition, a jump is a jump.


    Your argument fails the test of logic.

  6. #6
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    Wake up BASE 44

    I think BASE jumpers should have some kind of legal access to parks -- not a year-round free-for-all. But something.

    But if you think that fewer BASE jumpers will die if they are given legal access, you really need to pinch yourself. You are dreaming. Wake up.

    Open the doors to the parks and you'll see more jumps. The law of averages and probability will take care of the rest.

    When BASE jumpers start dying legally, who are you going to blame then? Hint: the same people you should be blaming now.

    We Skydivers and BASE jumpers are a rare bunch indeed; our capacity for denial is astounding.

    This is not a safe sport, it's not safer than driving your car to work -- or whatever other silly cliches we've spouted in years past.

    Skydiving & BASE jumping are very dangerous, very unforgiving activities that can be made reasonably safe when pursued by competent people, making smart decisions, using proper gear.

    Unfortunately, there will always be the "geek factor" -- those odd ducks who are least qualified and most motivated to be in this sport. I'm more worried about them than the NPS.

    Yes, get rid of the Winnbegos. Yes, Rock climbers are carving away the granite and leaving their share of blood on the walls. Yes BASE jumpers are being discriminated against.

    But until we get realistic about a few things ourselves, we'll never be accepted in the parks, much less by the public.

  7. #7
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    OUCH and BC need remedial reading and logic courses

    You guys continue to astound me with your utter lack of reading comprehension and logical ability.

    Try reading my posts again -- slowly (you know, maybe sounding the words out will help) and hopefull this time you will notice that there are no differences between what I've said and what you're whining about... other than the lovely little straw men you set up... of course, you probably don't know what a straw man is either.

    Jeez, did either of you yo yos even make it through high school?

  8. #8
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    4Base44

    Base44,

    I don't know that it is worth trying to explain logic to you, but I can explain why you are viewed by many as a nut-case. You have to seperate the issues if you want credibility. The fact that Scott Connelly is a convicted child molester is irrelevant. To continue to rant about "perverts" and "child molesters" clouds the real issue. Leave it alone. The Nazi references do nothing for your arguments. They make you look like an idiot.

    You and I and all the other base jumpers have the same goal: Legalized jumping in National Parks. Clouding your message with raves about perverts and child molesters just confuses the issue. Even your apology to Hayes ended up insulting the gentleman. Hayes' and the rest of the general public are important to our cause. We will need more political support than the 1000 or so base jumpers we have in this country.

    Remember, the issue is we are denied equal access to National Parks. We must demand that equal access is granted, and the more politically savy and publically palatable the demands, the more likely they will be granted. Can these demands be powerful, forceful, and unrelenting? Absolutely!! But we must be clear and consise.



  9. #9
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    Ouch is learning, but there's a difference twixt issue and process

    Hey there, young pup:

    Most of your last post made pretty good sense, but you ought to quit preaching to your elders and start listening a little more carefully to them and you'll learn a l ot more quicker.

    Like the old saying goes, your parents seem so dumb when you're a teenager and so much smarter after you GROW UP.

    Love,


    BASE44

  10. #10
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    Base44, missing the point

    You may either agree with what my last post said, or you may disagree. Deflecting my comments with a weak jab about my age is pointless to the argument at hand. Yes, I am younger than you and have less experience in BASE. Now that your superior position in the sport and advanced age are clear to all let's continue.

    You either agree that your previous posts with "perverts" and "Nazis" are ineffective or not. My point is that it is not effective to drag issues out of the past that cannot assist in the fight for equal access to national parks.

    Is your cause to gain access, or are you supporting self help groups for the victims of child molesters? We will gain more through concise, articulate communication than through ranting and raving.

  11. #11
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    Now this guy makes sense

    If you want to do BASE jumping a service, read the post by OUCH! rebutting BASE44. He is the the kind of person we need to communicate the basic issues that BASE44 is ineffectively attempting to communicate.

    BASE44 is clueless with regard to the politics involved. Maybe he should up his dosage of prozac.




  12. #12
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    On the surface, yes, but not when you look deeper

    Read my reply to Ouch.

  13. #13
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    Young pup, you've lost your concentration again

    Dear fine young pup:

    My comment about your age was not a weak jab but a gentle reminder that experience and knowledge change the way you see the world, and one of the chief things experience teaches is: There is usually more to a complex situation than meets the eye.

    My experience with BASE, personally, professionally, and politically, goes back 21 years, to about two weeks after Carl Boenish and his crew made the first jumps and sent pictures of them to me in my slot as editor of Parachutist, the U.S. Parachute Association magazine. Soon after, I started BASE jumping and have continued to jump and write about it and think about how to solve the problem with the NPS.

    Twenty-one years ago, you were probably still closer to wearing diapers than you were to getting your driver's license., and so, since you dismissed my gentle reminder, try this slap upside your eager young head, because you are a smart pup and will probably be all right with a little training and discipline.

    Soooo, you said:

    "You either agree that your previous posts with "perverts" and "Nazis" are ineffective or not."

    No, pup, life is not that simple. According to what definition? You presume to know my purpose and intent and goals without bothering to even ask what they are. You equally presume to know those same things about the NPS.

    You assume that your perception, your understanding of the problem, the issues involved, its history, the micro and macro political processes associated therewith, and the interrelationships themselves, is complete. But as Marshall McLuhan said: "Environments are invisible. Their groundrules, pervasive structures and overall patterns elude easy perception."

    So from where you stand, young pup, it’s easy to make a " point is that it is not effective to drag issues out of the past that cannot assist in the fight for equal access to national parks."

    But your point is baloney. You are flat out, undeniably and utterly ...wrong. In the matter of Connelly’s Cops, past IS present and that past will help the world really see this situation for what it really is. Briefly:

    The structure of NPS’s perverted policy reflects the perversion of the person who promulgated it. NPS’s "management ban on BASE jumping" is actually no more than the SYSTEMIC MOLESTATION OF POWERLESS INDIVIDUALS BY EMPOWERED INDIVIDUALS WHO USE THEIR STANDING IN THE COMMUNITY TO PREY ON WHOM THEY CHOOSE.

    The NPS policy toward BASE jumpers is a paradigm of predatory perversion... it’s a bureaucratic version of that supposedly respectable uncle -- the banker, the cop, the outstanding businessman -- who also sexually molests his nieces or nephews and then, even if they are brave enough to tell, they are not believed because who would think such a thing to be possible of good ol’ successful, favorite nice guy Uncle?

    That is precisely -- preCISEly -- what we are dealing with here: A perverted policy which mirrors the pervert who created it and that’s why I’m starting there, at the beginning, because Lao-Tzu said: Before we can understand the universe, we must call things by their right names. And after that Santayana said: Those who do not learn from history are condemned to repeat it.

    Yet you don’t want to mention past evils that are intrinsically relevant to our future. Were I to presume as much as you do, young pup, I would think that maybe you came from a family where there was sexual molestation that went unchallenged and never mentioned, and then buried in the past because it has nothing to do with today.

    But I won’t and I don’t. I say this only to help you register the pattern, see the environment, understand the pervasive structure through which we are weaving today’s actions.

    No, the reason you don’t want to mention past evils that are intrinsically relevant to our future is not because you’re evil or illogical or emotionally impaired; you just don’t know any better. And this is not a presumption but an analysis based upon your comments.

    And so I’ll say this again a little differently: Shut up and listen. God gave us two ears, two eyes and one mouth so we could listen and watch four times more than we talk. I appreciate your elan and your intelligence and your confidence and that is why I bother to even treat with you, but you really need to sit back and watch and listen for a while. Trust me; in six months you’ll look back on these posts and say to yourself, "Jeez, I was really clueless, wasn’t I?"

    And to answer your final question: My cause absolutely is to gain access, AND I am supporting a self-help group for the victims of child molesters:

    BASE jumpers and NPS rangers.

    We are all of us victims of the child molester Scott Connelly, and as soon as the rangers figure that out, they’ll dump his perverted policy as quickly as they dumped him once he got arrested.

    But excuse me for ranting and raving.


  14. #14
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    Base44 has Alzeimers

    You rant and you rave so much that any good message you deliver is clouded by anger. You are just plain wrong, and other than a few other ravers like yourself, you ARE viewed as a kook and now as a crazy OLD man. You cannot seperate the issues, and they are in fact, seperate. Your lack of ability to understand this is why you will always fail. 21 years of effort and you have accomplished NOTHING! We are exactly where we were 21 years ago. Your thought process is akin to the war on drugs, which has also blindly put forth a point a view for 20 years that is neither capable of solving a problem and to rigid to change with the times to meet the challenge.

    Since we can't teach an old dog new tricks, stand down and let the younger, contemporary thinkers do what your policy of anger and blind hatred has so pathetically failed at. If you think your "experience" and "past positions" have earned you respect you are sorely wrong. Your results (and angry misdirected posts) speak volumes about you.

    It is obvious you fancy yourself a leader in the base community. When I started base jumping, it's funny, I never heard of you. I heard of the real leaders who continue to lead and make real strides for BASE. People like Dennis and Avery who disagree as you do with current policy, but somehow actually make things happen.

    So sorry you lost your way, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

  15. #15
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    I guess I AM wrong... about you...

    As I said before, let's talk about this in six months. Until then, try not to take your board attitude into your BASE jumps or we won't get the chance.

    Love,


    BASE44

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