let's get to tha point!

[dirteedave]

So, I know that i want to jump, I've always known. I have re-evaluated over and over again. I started skydiving, which has taxed me hard, at least financially. I still know i want to make a transition to base when I am ready, jump tickets and gear for skydiving, and now almost all new gear for base?!!??!! I am looking for a way to make this work does anyone have any suggestion? I am also working fulltime and going to school, to be a paramedic, so when i wreck i'm shit out of luck, b ut a good bonus for any buddy. I guess what i am saying is that if anyone is willing to take on a student I am willing to travel for jumps! Please contact me if anyone has any advice or is willing to talk.

[hamsandwich]

Where are you located?

What DZ do you jump at?

Current Canopy?

Currency?



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[dirteedave]

I just moved back to michigan... for this medic class, the dz here doesn't open till april 4. I guess my real home dz is in AZ, I'm jumping 220's, and i am just at the A licensure level, I know I have a way to go before I would be comfortable making a base jump, but since that is the ultimate goal i thought i would start thinking and talking it over.

[hamsandwich]

There's a good amount of jumpers in Michigan.

Keep that 220. Here's some drills to work on:
http://www.asylumbase.com/adobepdf/fjccanopy.pdf

Work on accuracy skills, landing on a frisbee in to the wind, down wind, & cross wind. I myself have slacked on this and realized it on a demo recently.

Hang out at the rigging loft. Buy them beer.


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[nicknitro71]

Michigan?

Contact Tony Gwinn in Michigan...best guy I got over there, he'll death camp ya for pennies on the dollar.

http://www.egwingsuits.com/EGI.htm

[base1126]

What drop zone will you be jumping at? we're always looking for ground crew and new people to drink with it's good place to start. Hope to see ya around this summer.

Hoyt

[dirteedave]

Tecumseh, Like i said though, I'm a-license level, will prolly stick to opening above 2500' if I can help it at all, at least for the time being! I'll help ground crew anytime.

gene

[hamsandwich]

tecumseh? give amanda a credit card check for me when you get there.


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[base1126]

I'll be working out there doing tandems this year, see ya in a couple of weeks.


Hoyt

[hamsandwich]

Hey HOYT! I got your voicemail about the crane but forgot to call you. PM me your number so I can call and bullshit with you anyway.


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[UCCC]

Hey DirteeDave,

All I have to say is - "BaseR"

That will solve your skydiving/base gear situation. You could probably sell your rig and get a BaseR set up and have money left over.

[diablopilot]

You could dodge semi trucks on the highway too.....

Sonic, how are you handling the training for using a front mount reserve, and landing a round? Any actual formal training documented?

[JDATC]

Hey DirteeDave,

All I have to say is - "BaseR"

That will solve your skydiving/base gear situation. You could probably sell your rig and get a BaseR set up and have money left over.

Maybe you could use that money to pay Sonic to go out and make some real base jumps, that way he wouldn't have an excuse.

Or maybe for your medical bills judging by the performance of Sonic's base canopy in testing, you'll need it....

_justin

[dirteedave]

it's my again, I'm down ta post up on a ground crew in michigan for tha time being. I wanna learn as much as possible, I wanna help any way i can an the best way i can think is by being medical support. if you (anyone with experience with major trauma) had three wishes for a medical kit (within locals laws and protocols) what would they be and why? besides large bore IV lines and boluses and c-spine supplies (those are a given). what injuries are most common? I can think broken bones, c-spine injuries, fluid loss, pnuemo's, hemothorax's, long bone fracture's, head bleeds, shock, am I missing anything major and what what would you want to treat en route to the hospital. I will not be able to access drugs so don't say drugs. I'm talking first line stuff here guys. wish list too WISH being the operative word. These are things that You want to be able to do within minutes while the ambulance is on tha way. just wondering... i'm not gonna go get em I just wanna know what you think are the most common injuries you have seen. also if you could have permission from medical direction in the form of standing orders what would you want? If this is a real sport paramedics should be on hand with special consideration because it is such a quick response time, basically if you could have special consideration from local medical direction what would it look like... considering your sport is somewhat illicit and how could jumpers make this a more legitimate activity... can we discuss this with local hospitals and ems... is that going to far? could friends have had a better chance with more immediate care following incidents? Many times jumps occur where it would take hours for ems to respond would wilderness protocols for licensed professionals be appropriate? the list only alludes to a few cases. Is it possible to stay true to the heart of the sport while still providing immediate care even during illicit jumps? I am asking this from a never base'd perspective am I totally off?

[lifewithoutanet]

Okay, I'll bite, but only on the first-responder stuff.


also if you could have permission from medical direction in the form of standing orders what would you want? If this is a real sport paramedics should be on hand with special consideration because it is such a quick response time, basically if you could have special consideration from local medical direction what would it look like...

Generally speaking, in the completely modernized world, you're not going to need to give 'standing orders' to any Paramedic/EMS team assigned to an event and if you try, any experienced crew will probably laugh at you once you leave, if not in your face. Generally speaking (for those who might nitpick semantics), they'll stage themselves accordingly to be able to assist quickly in the event of an incident. But we cannot and should not expect anything unreasonable of them. You land out, off or on the side of something, you're just going to have to sit and wait until they get to you, which, given the terrain, could take a while. It's not like the organizer is going to say, "there's a ledge halfway up the canyon wall. We'd like to put a few of your guys there 'just in case'." They'll plan for the best coverage and that's what you should accept. If you don't like the coverage and the risk is too great to you, don't jump.

Now, in the not completely modernized world (and I'm not necessarily talking true "third world")...don't count on it. They don't always have the insurance requirements that the West has and if you ask me, that's the major driver in what and how much coverage is on-site. From personal experience at a major event, I got a huge wake up call as to what 'standard of care' means elsewhere in the world. Looking back--and I see the hypocrisy in what I'm about to say--the people they had on scene were woefully unprepared for major trauma.


Many times jumps occur where it would take hours for ems to respond would wilderness protocols for licensed professionals be appropriate? the list only alludes to a few cases.

Requiring a standard of care or protocols specifically for BASE jumping seems silly. The average Paramedic (and all but junior EMT-Bs) has seen far worse in motorcycle and auto crashes. My guess is that--if you're still alive--they'll have dealt with far worse in the course of 'routine' trauma...and if not, hopefully you just jumped from the roof of a hospital. For remote areas, well, you knew how remote it was when you walked out the door. It's your ass, your responsibility.


Is it possible to stay true to the heart of the sport while still providing immediate care even during illicit jumps? I am asking this from a never base'd perspective am I totally off?

This is a matter of opinion, but for me, personal responsibility is too high on the list to allow for these expectations, ESPECIALLY on illicit jumps. Some preparation on your and your fellow jumpers' parts is what should be expected, not holding 'licensed professionals' accountable for some fucknut twat who steps off a building in the middle of the night.

Having written all of this...I'll call BS on my own post and just say that if adequate medical response weighs so heavily on you as to require a certain standard of on-scene medical care...you may want to reevaluate whether you should be jumping at all.

Touching back to the "never BASE'd perspective" I'll say this. You've got a lot of exuberance and excitement, but you're focusing on an 'aspect' of the sport without even having an understanding of what could go wrong. You've skipped the "shit's happening, what do *I* do about it?" and gone to the "shit's HAPPENED, now who's responsible for putting my humpty-ass back together again?"

Oh...and as for BASE gear...go with not only the tried-and-true, but stick w/ the manufacturers that have put their heart, souls, families and mortgages behind YEARS of INNOVATION and JUMPING. They've earned your business.

-C.

[dirteedave]

I guess what I am saying is that in some cases some very easy things can be performed at the time of of an accident... Large bore IV's, fluids, spinal immobilization... easy stuff that would minimize on-scene time for ems once activated, they could also benefit the jumper immediately and add to the chances of long term survival. you mention bike wrecks I'd like to mention that football player that broke his neck last year... because of the medics there he's gonna be able to walk... that's the type of care i'm thinkin of. I'm not saying putting people up on ledges but when i climb i like to know that my partners know how to use rescue techniques. besides what could it hurt? are base jumpers just so bad ass that they don't need to plan for the inevitable?

[lifewithoutanet]

I guess what I am saying is that in some cases some very easy things can be performed at the time of of an accident... Large bore IV's, fluids, spinal immobilization... easy stuff that would minimize on-scene time for ems once activated, they could also benefit the jumper immediately and add to the chances of long term survival. you mention bike wrecks I'd like to mention that football player that broke his neck last year... because of the medics there he's gonna be able to walk... that's the type of care i'm thinkin of. I'm not saying putting people up on ledges but when i climb i like to know that my partners know how to use rescue techniques. besides what could it hurt? are base jumpers just so bad ass that they don't need to plan for the inevitable?

No, we're not that bad ass--at least I'm not. In fact, I have a pretty substantial med-kit that I bought when I had the chance to get it at a SUPER deal. Of course, I've never taken the vacation time to get the full training I want and the O2 has only been used recreationally.

In any case, I was responding purely to your points around licensed professionals as first responders, not well prepared jumpers. So sure, there's a ton of benefit to having the appropriate skills and kit on-hand, but the only time you're really gonna have licensed pros at the ready is an organized event. Otherwise, what...make the EMT-P on the load jump first? Or jump last? What if s/he gets fucked up? What then?

-C.

[dirteedave]

For me the appeal of base is that it is a covert activity. I have always wanted to be involved in an operation where we evaded tha cops cuz fuk them... its like robbin a bank but the only person who can get hurt is me... i'm drunk so if i don't make sense excuse me.

[hamsandwich]

its not as "cool" as it sounds.

if you want to base jump you'll know it. base jumping is not something you do as a chore or requirement to get something else. For instance, no one I know base jumps so they can evade cops. They'v had to evade cops though at one point or another to base jump.

If you want to run from cops, become a bank robber. I hear jumping over a bank counter with an ar-15 is one of the few things that beats a sketchy cliff.


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[dirteedave]

haha maybe i'll try that!!!

[dirteedave]

whaddya mean its not as cool as it sounds? of course it is... yes the jump is the objective but any climber will tell you that the summit is only the halfway mark! base in a city or nps presents quite a logistic problem... its a complete system that's what intrigues me it's like a covert civilian op that can succeed or fail... much like a bank job... maybe i've been watchin point break too much but the entire thing makes me want ta jump not just tha jump though i guess you're right it's all about tha jump! jus like a bank it's all about gettin away! go team go!!!!!!

[nicknitro71]

Maybe I'm getting old or just too many jumps...but I'd love to jump Legal objects all the time (at least 3x a week, if not every day). And FYI I jump that much off illigal ojbects. Running away from the cops costs me about 3000...Only if you are a trustfund baby like the man in black then running away from the cops and/or getting cough might sound like fun...for us, mare mortals without daddy's millions, no cops = more fun not the other way around.

Now do me a favor, get lost and go make over 500 base jumps. Then re-open this thread and give us your 0.02 once again.

[lifewithoutanet]

Maybe I'm getting old or just too many jumps...but I'd love to jump Legal objects all the time (at least 3x a week, if not every day). And FYI I jump that much off illigal ojbects. Running away from the cops costs me about 3000...Only if you are a trustfund baby like the man in black then running away from the cops and/or getting cough might sound like fun...for us, mare mortals without daddy's millions, no cops = more fun not the other way around.

Now do me a favor, get lost and go make over 500 base jumps. Then re-open this thread and give us your 0.02 once again.

Shit. Will somebody tell Nick that his account's been compromised and someone is posting as him. ;)

-C.

[dirteedave]

too late already lost mutha nucca...